Episode 26 of Design Discussions with Nadine had an amazing guest, Shaun Ayala of Pacific Sales. Shaun is an author, a fellow podcaster and a marketing guru.

His words of wisdom at 2023 KBIS were so powerful, it helped me change the way I look at marketing in my own company

You can purchase his book here https://www.amazon.com/dp/B0CV46Y9MP