Humans seem to be hard-wired to notice change — we put a big emphasis on new things, and we hate to lose things we value. But when everything is fine, and things are just coasting along — well, we don’t tend to notice them. Perhaps we don’t appreciate them as much as we would if we knew that one day they weren’t going to be there.

So on this episode I speak to Lee Potter Cavanagh, to find out what it’s like to close a bar — it’s his first — after four years in business. It’s a bittersweet time for Lee, he’s still working through how he feels about it all, and I can’t thank him enough for joining me to talk about it. Because we don’t often get an exit interview like this. People love to champion their successes but, understandably, when these sorts of difficult decisions are made, are usually less forthcoming, particularly to journalists. So a big thank you to Lee for being such an open book.